Morocco # English board

We use to have a post where we talked about our investment, or I should say, our ideas about markets and investments…so, who amongst the YABIS became rich recently? Just kidding…
But I thought may be we could reopen a post about that subject and exchange ideas. any takers? I mean buyers?
salaam,
Almot



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/28/2006 11:02 by almotanabi.

i am interested if anyone doing business with morocco ....is it worth to do it ?

by the way , i know a guy who buy used bikes (vtt),in the northeastern area, in winter time ,and ships a full container (maybe 500 bikes) during summer.

It seems he s doing well ....i am thinking to see what the moroccan markets needs , i might jump in the wagon maybe 2 or 3 years from now .



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/29/2006 06:35 by Obs2006.

Hi.

I’m interested on establishing a business in the tourism area in Agadir…..working mainly with German tourists …I really hope to realise this dream maximum within next 6 years …let’s see…

Quote
Ilhem2
Hi.

I’m interested on establishing a business in the tourism area in Agadir…..working mainly with German tourists …I really hope to realise this dream maximum within next 6 years …let’s see…

are u gonna open a restaurant ?

Source MAP
German arrested in southern Morocco for lewd conduct
Agadir, Mar. 28 - Moroccan authorities have arrested in Agadir (600km south of Rabat) a German tourist for homosexuality and sexual abuse on a minor.

According to local judicial sources, the minor, 17, confessed that he spent a night with the suspect for US 10 (MAD 100) and a cigarette pack.


The minor was arrested by a guard while he was attempting to leave the hotel, after spending the night with the 48 year-old tourist (M.R.M), who recognized the charges held against him.

Last week, some 250 pedophile pictures were seized in the same town in a search operation led in a caravan of a German pedophile, who was arrested red-handed.
According to a “Direction générale de la sûreté nationale” communiqué, the pictures show naked men, aged 15-21, including 15 Moroccans, adding that investigations revealed that suspect, a 67-year-old German tourist, lured his victims in his caravan to snap the indecent pictures for money (USD 4 or 7).

Hej Krim,

I was wondring that the subject was investing in Morocco and you come up with pedophilie in Agadir. you mean we should us Moroccan start investing in pedophilie instead of germain or what??..hehehe.. just kedding..

I know your point but i guess Ilhem too want a clean biz and you know for sure people are different. they are germain that comes to Morocco to enjoy our cimat, country side and the nice and delicious food.


best regard

Ilhem would like to invest in order to attract germans to Agadir. If one follow her way of thinking and by reading the article I copy/paste, this means she is helping pedophilie develop in Morocco.
Of course this thinking is ridiculous and particularly when billions of dollars are to be invested.

it's disappointing to see how many people wish to invest in tourism, I don't see anyone
who wants to invest in import-export, agriculture, small industry, technology and other interesting businesses that our economy needs to develop,
it's not encouraging to see how many of us are ready to wait for the tips of the people
who do the real business in their countries and come for tourism to morocco, they are welcome
but my point is that we shouldn't give to tourism more importance that what it is worth!

Even though I see your point, I don’t think you should be disappointed, I’m sure many other Moroccans are looking at the areas you mentioned. But right now there’s still lot of room in tourism and I don’t see problem with people trying to tap into that. I assure you, that when that source is dry, folks will have no choice but to look elsewhere. But I do want you to know that I get your point.
Almot

the problem in investing in tourism is very risky , look at what s happening in egypt , all you need one crazy extrem muslim to kill a tourist and you wll have european tourists avoiding that destination and go to tunisia or spain or somewhere else .

Hi everyone,


marocain_fier,


I want to invest in the tourism because it’s my profession …I don’t know much about other areas…and of course because of what almotanabi said as well …there is a lot to improve in the tourism in our country….



Obs2006,

I’d like to invest in the tour operating or international retail…nothing to do with a reataurant...

Hello Ilham,
I really think that it’s still great domain to tap in, just get well prepared before you jump in, study the market well and Allah will be with you.
But you know something, and I’m smiling a bit before I tell you this: “You might end up been helped by the UAE investment,, wouldn’t it be ironic if you business is successful because of the tourism from golf countries?” then I’ll stop by your office, or offices I hope, wave my finger and tell you: “see Ilham, it’s not all that bad after all..!!! I hope you’ll still offer me a cup of coffee or a free trip somewhere,lol
Salam to you Ilham,
Almot

Dear Almot,
I may be allowed to get in because of my german passeport.You may have difficulties since Ilham will be working with german tourists.
take care
Krim

salam everybody,

Hahahahaha almotanabi and Krim..…..guys you’re welcome in my office any time you come to the country and without any passport ( heh Krim)…you’re invited to drink coffe, tea be na3na3 or any thing you wish ….of course the trip will be for you for the Nett price …any service that I have not to pay for will be free for you and your family….I promise……just one thing …you bring a lot of money while visiting the country to contribute to its economy ok?!

for you krim even in Germany (Munich) the same is available if I get my business there…I’m going there very soon….


almotanabi,
of course I’ll study my project very good …I’ll have assistance for establishing it too….I’ve got potential clients and some good ideas …. the most important now is to take the decision …..It’s really not easy...particularly for my husband…
regarding you comment about people from the Golf countries… since I had some problems with guys from there I've promised my self to have nothing to do with them any more …I know it’s not intelligent for a business women to think like this but believe me I’m sick form this story …I really wish you could go visit there…. you will see yourself how those people think about us men and women …it’s really sad…it’s just too much…..anyway we’ll talk about it after your trip….

A very interesting article in the new york times today:

An Ugly Side of Free Trade: Sweatshops in Jordan

[www.nytimes.com]

Quote
almotanabi
A very interesting article in the new york times today:

An Ugly Side of Free Trade: Sweatshops in Jordan

[www.nytimes.com]

can you do for me a copy/paste , cuz i am so lazy , i dont wanna subscribe to read the article .
Thanx



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/04/2006 12:56 by Obs2006.

Here it is my friend,

Propelled by a free trade agreement with the United States, apparel manufacturing is booming in Jordan, its exports to America soaring twentyfold in the last five years.

Related
Report on Jordanian Clothing Factories (.pdf)

National Labor Committee
But some foreign workers in Jordanian factories that produce garments for Target, Wal-Mart and other American retailers are complaining of dismal conditions — of 20-hour days, of not being paid for months and of being hit by supervisors and jailed when they complain.
An advocacy group for workers contends that some apparel makers in Jordan, and some contractors that supply foreign workers to them, have engaged in human trafficking. Workers from Bangladesh said they paid $1,000 to $3,000 to work in Jordan, but when they arrived, their passports were confiscated, restricting their ability to leave and tying them to jobs that often pay far less than promised and far less than the country's minimum wage.
"We used to start at 8 in the morning, and we'd work until midnight, 1 or 2 a.m., seven days a week," said Nargis Akhter, a 25-year-old Bangladeshi who, in a phone interview from Bangladesh, said she worked last year for the Paramount Garment factory outside Amman. "When we were in Bangladesh they promised us we would receive $120 a month, but in the five months I was there I only got one month's salary — and that was just $50."
The advocacy group, the National Labor Committee, which is based in New York, found substandard conditions in more than 25 of Jordan's roughly 100 garment factories and is set to release a report on its findings today. Its findings were supported in interviews with current and former workers.
Such complaints have dogged the global apparel industry for years, even as it has adopted measures intended to improve working conditions in factories that produce clothing for American and European consumers. But the abusive conditions that the guest workers described show how hard it is to control sweatshops as factories spring up in new places, often without effective monitoring in place.
In recent years, Jordan has become a magnet for apparel manufacturers, helped by the privileged trade position that the United States has given it, first because of its 1994 peace accord with Israel and then because of a free trade agreement signed with Washington in 2001.
Jordan's apparel industry, which exported $1.2 billion to the United States last year, employs tens of thousands of guest workers, mainly from Bangladesh and China.
In interviews this week, five Bangladeshis who used to work in Jordanian apparel factories and four who still do had similar tales of paying more than $1,000 to work in Jordan, of working 90 to 120 hours a week, of not being paid the overtime guaranteed by Jordanian law, of sleeping 10 or 20 to a small dorm room. The National Labor Committee helped arrange interviews with the Bangladeshi workers, who spoke through interpreters.
The largest retailer in the United States, Wal-Mart, and one of the largest clothing makers, Jones Apparel, confirmed yesterday that they had discovered serious problems with the conditions at several major Jordanian factories.
In addition, a factory monitor for a major American company confirmed that Jordanian factories routinely confiscated their guest workers' passports, doctored wage and hour records and coached employees to lie to government and company inspectors about working conditions. The monitor asked not to be identified because the company had not given authorization to speak publicly.
Beth Keck, a spokeswoman for Wal-Mart, said the company did not own or manage factories, but tried to improve working conditions in Jordan and elsewhere. "It is a continuous challenge, not just for Wal-Mart but for any company," she said, noting that the most commonly observed problems included failure to pay proper wages, "egregious hours," and "use of false or insufficient books or documentation."
Charles Kernaghan, executive director of the National Labor Committee, which has exposed mistreatment in factories in Central America and China, said he was shocked by what he discovered in Jordan.
"These are the worst conditions I've ever seen," he said. "You have people working 48 hours straight. You have workers who were stripped of their passports, who don't have ID cards that allow them to go out on the street. If they're stopped, they can be imprisoned or deported, so they're trapped, often held under conditions of involuntary servitude."

Related
Report on Jordanian Clothing Factories (.pdf)

National Labor Committee
Mr. Kernaghan said Bangladeshi workers had contacted his organization to complain about working conditions in Jordan. He then traveled to Jordan and met quietly with dozens of workers. He said American companies, despite their monitoring efforts, were often slow to uncover workplace abuses because workers were coached to lie to them or were scared to speak out. Moreover, factories often send work out to substandard subcontractors without notifying American retailers.
Several factory owners in Jordan insisted that they treated their workers properly.
"Some people are always making allegations," said Karim Saifi, the owner of United Garment Manufacturing, a factory near Amman that workers criticized for long hours and wage violations. "As far as we know, we follow all the labor laws here. If we were not abiding by all of the local Jordan laws, we would not be able to operate."
Several foreign apparel workers said that while their factories required them to stay until midnight, the Jordanian workers were usually allowed to leave at 4 p.m.
Two large industrial zones outside Amman are thriving, having geared themselves to the American apparel market. They have attracted dozens of garment manufacturers, some with 200 workers, some with 2,000, that say they produce clothes for J. C. Penney, Sears, Wal-Mart, Gap and Target.
"It would be wrong to think that problems at a few places are representative of the 102 apparel factories in my country," said Yanal Beasha, Jordan's trade representative in Washington.
Jordan's ambassador to the United States, Karim Kawar, said "If there are any violations of our labor laws, we certainly take it seriously."
Mr. Beasha said Jordanian government inspectors monitor the working conditions in factories. But several guest workers said factory managers hid abuses by coaching workers to lie. Mr. Beasha said the Jordanian government cared about the welfare of foreign guest workers, noting that it enforced overtime laws and recently increased the minimum wage for citizens and guest workers.
But Mohammed Z., who has worked for more than a year at the Paramount Garment Factory, said that even though he worked more than 100 hours a week — normally from 7 to midnight seven days a week — the company refused to pay him overtime when he did not meet production targets. He asked that his last name be withheld for fear of retribution.
Having paid $2,000 to work in Jordan, he said, in an interview from Amman, "I'm not earning enough to repay my loan or to support my wife and son."
Unhappy that his passport has been confiscated, he said: "My identity has been taken by the company. I have no freedom because I have no freedom to move to other places."
Mohammed Saiful Islam, 30, a Bangladeshi who was production manager at Western Garment, said that several times the workers had to work until 4 a.m., then sleep on the factory's floor for a few hours, before resuming work at 8 a.m.
"The workers got so exhausted they became sick," he said. "They could hardly stay awake at their machines."
Mr. Saiful, who is in the United States to highlight poor working conditions in Jordan, pointed to a yellow and black fleece sweatshirt that he said his factory made. It had an Athletic Works label made for Wal-Mart, selling for $9.48.
"Sometimes when companies sent in monitors, the workers were instructed what to say," Mr. Saiful said.
Mohamed Irfan, who in a telephone interview from Jordan said he was Western's owner, said, "The workers get the minimum wage, and all times, there is no problem in our factory."
Mohamed Kasim, Paramount's owner, said his factory also paid its workers properly. Mr. Kasim and other factory managers said workers received free room and board and sometimes medical care.
But several workers said that when they were sick they did not receive medical care, but were instead punished and had their pay docked.
Several Bangladeshis said there were terrible conditions at factories that made clothes for Wal-Mart and Jones Apparel, which owns brands like Ms. Keck, the Wal-Mart spokeswoman, said company inspectors recently identified "serious violations" of its labor rules at three Jordanian factories. At Honorway Apparel Jordan, for example, which manufactures sleepwear for Wal-Mart, inspectors found employees working off the clock, managers who refused to pay overtime and wages that "could not be verified," Ms. Keck said. At the Ivory Garment Factory, which Wal-Mart ceased working with two years ago, inspectors found "egregious working hours."

Related
Report on Jordanian Clothing Factories (.pdf)

National Labor Committee
Joele Frank, a spokeswoman for Jones Apparel, said the company had also found "serious problems" at the Ivory Garment Factory, which produces Gloria Vanderbilt clothing, and said it would "monitor the situation closely." A spokesman for Sears Holding, said the company was investigating potential problems at Honorway, which produces clothes for Kmart, a division of Sears Holding.
A Kohl's spokeswoman denied workers' accusations that clothing sold by the company was made at several Jordanian factories with poor conditions. Target said it worked with only one factory that has come under criticism— Al Safa Garments, which Wal-Mart recently cited for labor violations.
Many retailers said their policy was, after discovering violations, to work with a factory to improve conditions, rather than automatically withdraw their business. Wal-Mart says it gives factories a year to fix serious problems, reinspecting them every 120 days.
"Our business with the factory is the only leverage we have to push for improvement," Ms. Keck said.
After The New York Times asked about the accusations on Monday, Wal-Mart dispatched two inspectors to Jordan.
Hazrat Ali, 25, who worked from September 2004 to March 2005 at the Al Shahaed factory, said he sometimes worked 48 hours in a row and received no pay for the six months.
"If we asked for money, they hit us," he said.
Nasima Akhter, 30, said that the Western factory gave its workers a half-glass of tea for breakfast and often rice and some rotten chicken for lunch.
"In the four months I was in Jordan, they didn't pay us a single penny," she said. "When we asked management for our money and for better food, they were very angry at us. We were put in some sort of jail for four days without anything to eat. And then they forced us to go back to Bangladesh."
By STEVEN GREENHOUSE and MICHAEL BARBARO, May 3 06

Thanx for the link almot .


It s a problem of a cost production from the jordain side ,not from the Us side .

Walmart pays "X" a jordan company to make 1 million Tshirt for 2$ a piece , the x company either accept the deal or refuse it .

So in other words , x company has to use some tricks to make the cost of production as low as possible .

So who to blame ?
walmart for paying only 2 $ a tshirt ?
or the x company for accepting the deal ?

maybe we should blame capitalism ?

And remember if the jordan company didnt do the job , someone else will do it .

Welcome to the big game .



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/04/2006 01:26 by Obs2006.