Morocco # English board

jallal is very famouse in the netherlands..he is from morocco an lives since 2.5 years in the netherlands.
you see him in many dutch tv programs


he is a male moroccan belly dancer..

check this crazy movie of him..alot of moroccans in the netherlands want to kill this psycho.


he is orginaly from meknes in morocco
[www.youngworks.nl]

salam all
why shame for the moroccan nation, you can say shame on him as we have a say in morocco li aata .... lahla yfokou you understand what i mean, we need subjet that we can learn something from each other not not garbage like that.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/26/2007 10:40 by nassim9999.

I am not for this kind of thing and it does annoy me too. However, I thought males belly dancers were a long time tradition in Morocco.... As to killing, I think we should leave that kind of judgement to God...

very passive approch, lazy too...

one word comes to mind: DISCUSTING!!!!!

hahaha i love it, it s hilarious.
he s dancing around like some crazy duracell doll.

why shame for the moroccan nation??? this type of stuff won t shame me. and it shouldn t shame you either.
there has to be all kinds of people to form a nation.

He's a good dancer, really very good.

This's an art and have nothing to do with shame, be open mind peuple.

I'm very proud about what he's doing. He represents only him self and realy don't understand why a lot of moroccans in the netherlands want to kill this boy. May be they became very jealous of his sudden success

More power to him!
Some already said so, but the bet belly dance coaches in Eygpt are men and old ones, too.
As to Shame!!! well the real shameful thing(S) are things that hurt people in their lives and loved ones. need I give examples!

There are hundreds of guys dancing with "siniat and shamaa'" in the streets of Morocco and getting pennies a day, and when somebody( Morocan) gets creative elsewhere in Europe, he's a shame to the nation! Let's touch on the real shameful propaganda that's hurting the unity of the Moroccan Nation,if you see what I mean!Let's debate the causes that lead to people debasing and dehumanising themselves to survive...and come with something Positive t improve their life,rather than come out with utter stupidities that are nothing but band aids on cancerous cells...

As to those who want or think of Killing the Guy/ well that's homophobia for you to say the least.

One last thing, would it be OK if it were a Moroccan young womam?

Nothing new here, male dancers have been around for centuries, I've seen a documentary on one of them practising his art in Marrakech, he was actually very good.
The "shame for the moroccan nation" is in the stupidity of the guys wanting to kill him, not in an artist practising his art.

Art is art, the beauty of it, is question of taste, wanting to kill an artist because the art doesn't fit one's standards is just intolerance, not to mention...moronic.

We Moroccans are a shame anyplace we go, some people are ashamed of saying they're Moroccans because there's not a lot of things to be proud of, believe me boys and girls we SUCK ! our country's another Thailand for those who're looking for sexual pleasure, and some guys here who're defending this asshole dancer are a bunch of sissies, that bastard's gotta go and bury himself alive, gimme a break man ! that's what we're in lack of : a f***ing male belly dancer !!!!, as we say in arabic : in lam tasta7i fasna3 ma Shi't !

Live and let Live. I live in Holland and I don't care about such people. If he is loving what he's doing let him be. Only God can judge us, so stop judging people.

Peace.

shame on the human that judges! I am a Muslim Moroccan girl and I am proud of it!!! morocccan people didn't invent prostitution dear shelby or something...

That may be true pistachette, but what Shelby is saying is just the truth. Stop closing your eyes for things going on in Morocco. We are all proud to be moroccans, and that's why Shelby says someting like that. Because he gives too much about our homeland and it hurts seeing people doing some nasty things.

Peace.

excuse me but being proud of one's country suppose to be ready to support and defend it not to be ashamed being a part of it and I well understood what mister shelby tried to say I quote " some people are ashamed of saying they're Moroccans because there's not a lot of things to be proud of, believe me boys and girls we SUCK" !!!! I don't suck and neither do the women and the men that try hard to earn a living! if you feel yourself better than your countrymen then give them the solution Einstein

Now I understand what you tried to say. There is no need to be ashame of being a Moroccan, just let us try making Morocco a better place to live. Things won't change by themselve.

why we have to be shame for being a moroccan! cz we have protitution in morocco? saudia arabia is full of male protitution. they rank number 1 in the arab world.they rank also number one in the world of searching to gayporn/porn on the net.

what do u think about tunesia/algeria egypt.they also full with them. only in the capitol of iran there are more than 300.000 hookers.


morocco is a child if it comes on protitution with other arab countries.

you can t just put everybody in the same basket. and like i mentioned in a previous post, there s a good and a bad sad to everything...Morocco included!
and to take offense in such a thing as a guy doing a belly dance, well i'm sorry, but i personally am way better than that.
such things have nothing to do with me so why would i be ashamed by them!???

hey there, everyone ! it's no fluke folks, our country's ranked N°2, just after Brazil and that sure has a meaning, we outrun thailand and some well-known countries in this field ( prostitution) and that's the plain bitter truth, i'm sorry but what's happening here in Morocco's just outstanding ! wallahi we're running into something more disastrous than hell, why in hell our girls have turned this way? you can go strolling down the streets and see what i'm talking about,.. listen up: i don't care about thailand, philippines, ...most of these countries are not islamic ( except minorities), Morocco's somthing else, we're Moslems before everything else, prostitution has taken its place in our daily conversations, it's not something that's like'' sa7abat saif"( summer cloud )no, Morocco's suffering, believe me i'm not dramatizing but i repeat it's the naked truth ! today i've even heard of awful stuff, someplace in Maknas or its suburbs during ALMawlid Alnabawi and the annual fest of a Wali named "something cheikh Al 7amdouchi" people attended some GAYs marriage !! yeah and i say GAYs marriage the old way ( not the western way), with henna and ...i'm about to puke !!! i'm afraid something bad like Sodom's day will...GOD FORBID !

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Morocco's suffering, believe me i'm not dramatizing but i repeat it's the naked truth ! today i've even heard of awful stuff, someplace in Maknas or its suburbs during ALMawlid Alnabawi and the annual fest of a Wali named "something cheikh Al 7amdouchi" people attended some GAYs marriage !! yeah and i say GAYs marriage the old way ( not the western way), with henna and ...i'm about to puke !!! i'm afraid something bad like Sodom's day will...GOD FORBID !]

I'm not even shocked anymore. Last year I was really shocked when my best friend there told me about Gays in casablanca standing late at night in the streets for customers. I could not believe him. About the girls...don't even start about them. I think there are still 5 or 10% of the girls you can trust and are "bnate darhoem". The rest is following the american way. When you see a Mother with "7ijab" with her daughter wearing clothes that don't even leave anything to the imagination...well...I'm sorry but we've gone too far. And I'm also really afraid that something really bad is going to happen in the near future. Mark my words...

hi everyone,

well I am a moroccan that lives in the Netherlands and to be honest I never heard of any jallal belly dancer but than again it is not something that I would search for to see. To say shame on Morocco is a bit to much as it whas his own choise to do so. And to kill someone like him is just low, I mean come on he certainly has not had much of mother love in his childhood haha.






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www.matjar.ma

you can say that again Mr Hitman ! you're dead right !

Individual rights and not flock´s mentality. It is his business.

oh you know man, there is thing kind of stuff...

we have a gay community in the country. love it or not. we have boys and girls doing some twisted s*** in the country... and outside the country...

i'm in Paris, and you dont even imagine how many times a french dude told me some BS like "wow? morroco? your girls are twisted, they do some crazy s***"... what can i say?

it's true... it's sad... and it's not always because of poverty or lack of education...

we live in a crazy world, and we have our part.

but you can be proud to know that we have very good people in our country. honest workers, great minds. noble people... good Muslims... there is some light.

and i dont want to see them dead... i just dont want to see them. i wish i could say "i dont believe in that"... but unfortunately, we see them more and more... they exist. as long as they are far from the kids in my family. i'm fine.

that's what we're in lack of a nice community of gays and whores, i'de better off be dead, you can ask anybody who's been to morocco, or those who live in jordan, Bahrain, UAE you name it ...that's all what they could tell you even before they mention couscous, whores, whores and whores !! plenty of'em, i'd better go and ram my head into a wall ! i'm done !

Shelby, do you have a wife, a mother? sisters? daughters? How would you feel if people talked about them the way you are doing?

One more thing, as my husband always says, if there are women dating in a Muslim society, it means that there are men dating them, and probably dating several at the same time. No one dates his own person.As to prostitutes, they sure have a solid local clientele, otherwise they would not exist.But I guess the next easy target after gays is women, right?

Shireen... you dont know everything... there is a difference between dating... having sex, and being a prostitute.

gays are one thing. prostitution is another... and women dating is another story.

first, there is a cultural way for dating. if the man is serious, he comes to the house of the woman. and asks her parents their permission and "protection"... so he could "talk" with the girl as a "fiance"... taking the time to know her. with a promise of mariage.

if they get along, it's fine. if they dont... they break the relation politely.

now, to "date" like in the Western countries... it's NOT our culture. our sisters dont sleep with men... not before mariage... it's a religious thing. it deserves respect.

now, the religion is able to follow the evolution of mankind... but still... we still have a lot of abortions... a lot of orphans and abandonned kids... poverty... uneducation... abandonned kids... bad parents... AIDS... uneducated men not respecting the women and not taking their responsabilities as men...

it's NOT the right time for a full freedom on this point... if the religion starts giving too much, the society will be destroyed...

and about the gays... it's another story.
first, you have the right of the parents to control their kids. they are responsible of their kids. so we give them some rights. and one of this right is to choose the religion of their kids.
and Islam bans homosexuality. it's not "fighted"... but it's NOT CORRECT.

so gays arent "liked"... they are banned from society. they live in the "dark area" of the society. they exist. but we dont want to see them. we DONT have to accept them. to love them...to respect them... we are free... we decided to judge people following their respect for religion. these guys have NO RESPECT for religion... so we judge them as dangerous people who shouldnt get near our kids...

and i defy anyone to say that it's "bad"... it's OUR right to take our distances.

but now, there is a wave of useless freedom all over the world... the gays start acting and moving... they want to be seen... and this is a violation of our right to not see them. we forgive their "cultural difference"... but they are aggressors now... they want to enter our lives by force... now, they are looking for trouble...

Le Mask,
It seems this is a huge misunderstanding. I don't remember stating anywhere that I thought I knew everything, no one does, except for God. I deeply respect Islam but I do not make judgements on people as if I were perfect.I have seen very kind gays and very evil heterosexuals. So who am I to decide which one is worse? That's God's right not mine. Moreover, I do not promote the Western way of dating, heaven forbid, and I know the difference between dating, prostitution and homosexuality, you don't need to be Einstein to get that one. The only thing that I have a problem with is someone calling all Moroccan girls whores. What I meant to say, and apologies if that was not clear enough, is that women's behavior is Morocco is encouraged by men's attitude. Our society thinks that a man following another woman in the street that he has never seen before is fine. Our men take pride in dating multiple girls and in cheating on their wives and our society will never blame them for that. These are the very girls they call whores afterwards.For having lived in the US and now being settled in Paris unfortunately I have to say that the country where I get mostly annoyed by men is my own, and I spend a lot of time justifying that kind of behavior to western women who have visited Morocco or who plan to visit but are wary of being targetted. But please don't get me wrong, I have no excuses for women with no moral values but I think the same applies to men. Unfortunately no one thinks to worry about the latter part.

Hope this clears the air.

Well that's very clear Miss/Mrs. Shireen. I agree with everything you say. But Men don't force girls to sleep with them do they? When I talk to a girl on the street she has the full right to remain silent or just hit me in the face. People will always protect the girl in this case and I will be responsible for what I've done. Unfortunately in real life this is not what happens. Most girls are glad to see someone giving them attention. They know he's cheating them, but as long he go out with her and buy things for her she's fine. We should not blame the people, but blame the poverty. Being poor makes you do things you don't even want to do. The sad thing is when I see girls doing dirty things and the parents are fully aware of that. They encourage her to do that so they have something to eat or to build higher buildings. Like Omar Ibn Elkhattab (3alayhi essalam) once said: "If poverty was a man I would killed him with my own sword."

About Men targeting girls, this is too sad for words. It's getting normal every year I visite Morocco. Even when the girl is with her parents there is just no respect. Men above 50 targeting minor girls is getting normal. But like I said before: The one to blame is poverty. The girl needs money and she does everything to get it. Besides...don't forget the influence people has on each other. Girls are pushing each other to do things they don't want to do. And Men are doing the same. When Men are with each other the only thing you hear is how much girls he has and what he's been doing with them. Girls are talking about the great villa they went in, or the car they drove. So it's normal that people will do the same to experience the same thing. Forget about pride, religion or culture. The only thing with value now in Morocco and other countries is money. People are getting more and more materialistic.

You talk about society is not blaming Men who are cheating on their wives...I don't know who the society is but I blame them. I won't forgive anyone cheating on his wife and vice versa. If a friend of mine will do that I won't consider him as a friend anymore. Maybe I'm old school, but that's the way it is.

The only thing we need in Morocco is more respect for each other. Since we got the Satellite (and now Internet) things are getting worse over there.
It was forbidden for a girl to smoke. Now they do that in public.
The women lingerie was always at the back of the store, and women were very shy to buy it from a man. Now you can see clearly the lingerie in the front of the store and men are saling them.
Make-up was always just for married women or in special occasions.Now they can not walk out the door without it.
Having sex was prohibited for married people. Now they try out everything they see on Internet or Satellite.

And the list will go on and on...People should have more values and return to their culture.

Peace.

my dear Shireen...
i understand how you see the things, but unfortunately, life isnt working that way...

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I deeply respect Islam but I do not make judgements on people as if I were perfect.

good... but... so what? should we forgive the criminals because mistake is human? nobody is perfect?
dont you see? this logic isnt working... we should care for the others, make efforts... but dont ask us to accept everything because it's "human"... nobody is perfect... but it's not a reason to give up.

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I have seen very kind gays and very evil heterosexuals.

and i've seen irrespectuous gay people... why it's up to you to decide? god decided, and he said "man with women" and this is what we do. if the gays want to do something else, it's FINE with me. but cant they go make this stuff somewhere else? far from me if possible? is it too much? everybody minds it's own bussiness and everybody will be fine. i abuse nobody saying that...

and Shireen, i understand that very well... but it's not EASY... saying that all Morrocan girls are whore is just a plain insult...
but to be honest... a lot of girls you could see as "innocent" with your western influenced mind are total whores...
excuse me, but a woman doesnt have to be so provocative.

you arent a baby anymore, you know how the men work... they see a body... their mind starts working... and this "process" is very powerful in our countries... we dont have the habit to see half naked girls in the streets... be honest.
our culture is different... we have modesty and discretion as high moral values... a man AND a woman have to be modest and somehow "stealthy"...

all these problems come from our dumb mentality... we copy the Western countries blindly... like morons... and now, we have tons of problems...

and dont worry about that, i'm very aware that a lot of man act like dogs... you think i dont know that? we just cant really judge them about how they look...
a woman can wear something "modest" or even a Hijab if she wants safety... but what a man should do to show that he is a serious man? it's different...

but i give you that, some men behave like dogs...

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a lot of girls you could see as "innocent" with your western influenced mind are total whores

Darn right there! Sorry to say this but even girls wearing Hijab do not have my trust this days. I've seen and experienced shocking things to still trust any woman just like that.

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they see a body... their mind starts working... and this "process" is very powerful in our countries... we dont have the habit to see half naked girls in the streets... be honest. our culture is different... we have modesty and discretion as high moral values... a man AND a woman have to be modest and somehow "stealthy"...
all these problems come from our dumb mentality... we copy the Western countries blindly... like morons... and now, we have tons of problems...

I agree with you again. Like I said before: Since the satellite found his way to our homes in Morocco things began to change slowly. People are just copying the western countries and that's a big shame, 'cause they forget about our culture.

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a woman can wear something "modest" or even a Hijab if she wants safety

You think you can trust a woman wearing Hijab nowadays? Most of them my bro have already done everything in life and at the end they wear the Hijab to get a serious look. Even with Hijab some of them are doing things even a whore won't do. Please don't make a mistake bro. It's just a way to hide the things they are doing.
You're right about the fact that most men are acting like dogs, but that does not mean that girls should act the same way and give satisfaction to them! The problem is that we forget about what Islam says and follow the Unbelievers rules. It must come to an end before it's too late.

Peace