Now: i dont kniw how do you feel on this but every time an execution is carried out in the US i feel so disgusted....
I was already sure that Shwarzy, the ex Mister Olympia, the ex actor and now actual Governor of California was not gonna have mercy.... This regards in particular Tookie, but in general regards all the people in the american jails "death row".
Oh yes....that is the imperialistic country that wants to conquer and redeem the rest of the world..... it gives me shivers.....
You know to hear about death penalty in the US sound so much worst than to hear about death penalty in China for example....since they insist so much on thinking they are such a democratic country..... phuahhh....
This was intended as a long post but i guess the words i wrote make you understand my mood today..... i will not eat as my lonely abd secret sign of protest and will carry on my little protest that is not to go in the US for holiday and avoiding Made in the US products (that since they abuse on third world labour it is very diffucult to find a Made in the US label).
A state is not supposed to kill it´s citizens. But protect them and provide them with education. Think that Tookie has been sitting in death chamber since 1979. Being locked in a cell for 26 years, isolated and never knowing if tomorrow will be your last day in that cell is more than enough punishement in itself. I just hope they will wake up one day and think about what they are doing and how did it ever help them.
cali
Usually, terrible things that are done with the excuse that progress requires them are not really progress at all, but just terrible things.
Russell Baker
I do understand your feelings but I do not agree with your views.
So let's I come to Italy to visit you then I pick up my gun and shoot your monther, your father and your children if you have any.
Do you still think that I do not deserve the death penality?
Personnaly if Georgina comes and kill my parents I will drink of her blood. Maybe it is a savage thing to do but Justice means to kill anyone who kills.
I agree that this should be done only when we are 100% sure that the person is a killer.
In case of Tookie, he killed 4 people. So he deserved to die in my view.
Otherwise what other punishement do you suggest for criminals?
For example: Let's say we have captured the criminals who killed 300 children in a school in Russia. What would you do with them? Personaly I will seek the death penalty for them unless the families of the victimes forgive them.
In Islam, the killer is to be killed and I am happy USA is applying this Islamique law. There is only one case where the killer is not to be killed it is in case the family of the victime forgives the killer. In case of Tookie, the families of the victimes did not want to forgive him and they do have the right not to forgive him and do have the right to have him killed exactly as he killed 4 people.
Justice does not mean being soft with the criminals.
If a criminal is innocent then I do agree with your views.
Tookie is just a case among many! The main Question here is Are you for or against the DEATH PENALTY? in the case of, mdlazzrag; you make it clear, you are and for good reasons you explained!
I am undecided! And I know:
If we go an Eye for an Eye, We'll all go blind! (Ghandi, paraphrased!)
As it has been said " it is difficult to jump on the train once it leaves the station".
We are discussing a small facet of a whole social structure. In my opinion the Yankee society is infected with sevral viral types of injustice: educational inequities, racial inequities, gender inequities, economic enequities, etc etc etc
In my opinion as long as the dominant inequalites are maintained, in any society, there can't be Justice. In a society that has quasiequality, such as 13 centries ago under Islamic rule,wether there is capital punishement or not it is almost irrelevant.People had a sence of justice and peace. I don't want to be critical of the us where we at least are out of the darck enough to see and talk about injustice.I personally believe that executing an ex-gang founder is not just. In most places on the planet today injustice is so dominant that such a discussion is a luxoury.People are disappearing without a trace, people are routeenly jailed without any process of law. In the US of A people have had just a taste of what others are daily subjected to.This may be good for humanity as a whole because the forces of descent are very powerful within the the US and may be an excellent prototype for the rest of humanity.
Mdlazreg sbah i noor, i am i a way terrified from your words my dear.... If you come to italy and kill some of my parents.... unfortunately it wont make me happy knowing that eventually they will kill you. Think about it, i have lost someone i love.... easy, and simple, why should i be happy that revenge has been applied?Bear in miond that revenge and do wewhat has been done to you can have fatal disaster as in consequences.... The loss of someone you love cannot be replaced from the killer's death. It simply cannot, and i wish myself as i wish to you also that we will never experience a similar disgrace, but still i have the feelings we would not sleep better knowing that the old saying "an eye for an eye" has been done. Justice means that if they have certified that you are guilty you need to stay in a jail until they have decided to....Jail is already a punishment... may be you have never had nothing to do with prison, personally me neither, I AM CLEAN, but i have had someone i know going to that experience.....
Freedom is one of the best thing we have in life and not having it is the punishment, the words of Mahatma GHANDI say it all.... Thank you Yani.
I am totally and always will be against Death penalty and i am also an activist with some italian organisations.
Now: i would understand menthally that you or i could go and "with our hands" would kill the persons that killed our dears but then, they would take us, and so on.... and so on..... and so on.
This was in memory of Tookie because it happened now but more than anything else in memory of all the innocent and poor desperates that not being able to pay for one of the great names of "la crème de la crème of attorneys" were killed by another guilty hands in the name of JUSTICE.
In my opinion,it was wrong even to arrest him,jail him nor to execute him.He should have being freed and rewarded. We should get rid of all the jails,the police and even the army.We should be free to help ourselves to others people properties,vandalise and kill when we feel like it. We should salut the killers and hightly respect them.
I am against the death penalty,and all the criminals should be freed and the rest of the societe put in prison. Anyway this is my opinion.And i hope i haven't offended anyone.
Dear Georgina It is better not to take this white/blacke thinking seriously. Lurcher21 is just translating a typical moroccan furious thinking into english. The issue of death penalty is highly controversial everywhere.In the civilized world. the death penalty was abolished for good reasons and generally replaced with prison for life and sometimes with shorter periods. Some criminals are free under some circumstences and are again integrated in the society. So they get a second chance. Errors are human and everyone should learn from his mistakes, that´s why a second chance.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/20/2005 11:03 by Krim.
And I forgot to add that killing is a great way to be famous. Anyone one can become a star, just like the Yorkshire Ripper. If ever he is let out he would be a millionaire. In fact he is already making money in jail, from selling his stories about how he throttled his victims! I have to point out that giving one chance to a murderer to rehabilitate is not enough, they require a lot more. I know about some in England who have been given up to 4 chances, let out to integrate into society. Poor things. They can't help it. They throttled some more and ended up in prison again.
Sbah Al-Ward Wa Al-Narjis Wa Al-Yassamine Wa Al-Koronfo
> i am i a way terrified from your words my > dear....
It was not my intention to terrify you but let me explain maybe you will be less terrified :
> If you come to italy and kill some of my > parents.... unfortunately it wont make me happy > knowing that eventually they will kill you. Think > about it, i have lost someone i love.... easy, and > simple, why should i be happy that revenge has > been applied?
It is a wonderful thing that you can feel this way and my opinion does not concern those cases. In other words If the family of a victim is as good as you are to the point that they are able to forgive the killer of their beloved person then I have no problem if this killer is forgiven.
What I am defending here, is the right of the family of a victim to take justice if they want to. And I feel it will be injustice if Georgina comes and takes this right from the family of the victim.
In other words, Georgina is free to forgive the killer of her beloved ones but she has absolutly no right to force others to think her ways.
She might want to convince the others that it is not a good thing to take revenge [which in my opinion is a good thing to do] but she has absolutly no right in creating laws that will force everyone to behave the way she thinks is a good way.
I hope you understand the angle I am looking from.
>Bear in miond that revenge and do > wewhat has been done to you can have fatal > disaster as in consequences.... > The loss of someone you love cannot be replaced > from the killer's death.
While it is true it does not replace the loss of the beloved ones, some people will feel better if they know that the killer of their beloved ones has been killed as well. And we should under no circumstances take this right of them. It is up to them to decide to forgive or not. It is not up to you or anyone else to force them to forgive. It should be a matter of their entire choice. And If they choose to have the killer killed then it is their right.
Also knowing that the death penalty will be applied against hidious crimes is a deterent for many criminals. If however a criminal knows that in any case he will not die he might not think twice before commiting his crime.
For those reasons the death penalty should stay as a punishement for hidous crimes where we are 100% sure that the criminal commited his crime. And we should give the right of forgiveness only to the affected family.
It is was me who was making the laws I will not ask Arnold Shwarzeneger for forgivness I will ask the family. If the family decides to forgive then so be it otherwise the criminal who killed 4 people should be executed.
>It simply cannot, and i > wish myself as i wish to you also that we will > never experience a similar disgrace, but still i > have the feelings we would not sleep better > knowing that the old saying "an eye for an eye" > has been done.
You will not sleep better and I do respect that. But they are others who will never sleep better until the killer of their beloved is brought to justice and killed as well. You should respect them as well in their search for justice.
Also if you force the family of a victime not to take justice as they intend it to be, how would you sleep better? knowing that you have commited an injustice against the family by taking their right to decide about forgiving or not forgiving...
> Justice means that if they have certified that you > are guilty you need to stay in a jail until they > have decided to....Jail is already a punishment... > may be you have never had nothing to do with > prison, personally me neither, I AM CLEAN, but i > have had someone i know going to that > experience.....
I do agree that Jail is already a punishement. But again it is not up to you to decide if a criminal should be punished by Jail or by the death penatly. It is up to the family of the victim.
> > Freedom is one of the best thing we have in life > and not having it is the punishment, the words of > Mahatma GHANDI say it all.... > Thank you Yani.
While I do respect Mahatma Ghandi, I do not share his idealistic view. I think that the guy who assassinated Ghandi should be executed as well.
> > I am totally and always will be against Death > penalty and i am also an activist with some > italian organisations.
That is a wonderful thing to do. However you should know what you are defending. If you are teaching people that forgiving is a good thing then you are in the right track. If however you are working activly to take the rights of the families of the victims to decide what to do with a criminal who killed someone in their family then you are yourself an unjust person.
While fightying injustice you become yourself injust...
> > Now: i would understand menthally that you or i > could go and "with our hands" would kill the > persons that killed our dears but then, they would > take us, and so on.... and so on..... and so on. >
That is not true. Now that Tookie has been executed, his family will not go and kill the family of the victims. For the simple reason that the family of Tookie know that he did what he did and it is the right of the family of the victims not to forgive if they do not want to.
> This was in memory of Tookie because it happened > now but more than anything else in memory of all > the innocent and poor desperates that not being > able to pay for one of the great names of "la > crème de la crème of attorneys" were killed by > another guilty hands in the name of JUSTICE. >
If you are talking about the innocents then I do agree with you. I am talking about the criminals.
chargement...
